[PJUG Javamail] Is software engineering in the US dead?

[Joe Sam Shirah]

    Hi Howard,

    I've stayed out of this too, because on lists and forums we preach to
the choir.  This kind of information needs to get to decision makers.  It's
the same reason I've really reconsidered speaking at user groups and
decreased my article output - the attendees say "Great," use my ideas, and I
get no work out of it.  I'm considering reaiming at manager groups.  Now, I
don't do things just for monetary results, but...

    Anyhow, I've seen this stuff first hand, and there's politics as well as
real considerations involved.  I proved to a Fortune 100 corporation that 
not only was our code "better" but cheaper overall.  The reply was "it's a 
corporate direction," and they returned to offshore.  So you have inertia 
and often someone upstairs will look bad, so no go.  It turns out the actual 
money isn't always that important.

    But, the real reason I responded to your post is that many of the
components you listed are in my definition of quality;  To cliche land ( but
the reason most cliches exist is because they are true ) "Quality doesn't
cost, it pays."


                                                         Joe Sam

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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Howard Abrams" <howard.abrams at gmail.com>
To: <javamail at pjug.org>
Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 2:16 PM
Subject: Re: [PJUG Javamail] Is software engineering in the US dead?


> As I've been following this thread, I'm struck by how much the word
> "quality" has been bantered around. We feel that we can justify our
> higher cost due our better quality, but this strikes me as not very
> tenable. I mean, how often do each of us shop at Walmart for our sound
> systems as opposed to Echo Audio or Bose, What about Winco vs New
> Seasons, or... you get the picture. As both business-people and
> consumers, we often choose cheaper Chinese goods instead of better
> quality versions from the U.S..
>
> I have a toaster made in 1950 that still works (I've blogged about the
> details), but few people are willing to spend extra money for a
> perceived increase in quality.
>
> Of course, some people will spend more on something that they feel
> will last longer or has another aspect of "value". People who purchase
> Macs typically say the extra value they feel they are getting is worth
> the extra cost. But "value" is a difficult metric, and while one
> person may claim that a Mac is "better", another can disagree with the
> same reason.
>
> While it is beside the point, I have found plenty of code produced by
> American engineers that lack quality.
>
> My point isn't to start up any flames (esp with your Mac and PC
> zealots out there), but to get us thinking that maybe we, as a
> community of engineers, could come up with more tenable arguments to
> back up our "quality" rationale:
> Language, timezone, culture, and communication.
> Long-term support and maintenance
> Produce code closer to requirements quicker
> Better able to render business requirements into business code
>
> Leave it to me to change a discussion towards philosophy...
>